Competitive Pokemon
#1
With the recent advent of the 2015 World Championships, I think it's high time we had a thread like this. Whether you play by Nintendo's official VGC rules, or Smogon's infamous tierlist, or maybe something else I haven't heard of, discuss it here. Of course, if you feel like challenging another user, you can do that here too.

Personally I prefer to play by VGC rules, although I have dabbled in Smogon's OU, Uber, RU and LC tiers. To me, VGC is a much more flexible metagame, with so much more viable strategies. Ever tried running Trick Room in Singles? It just doesn't work. One of my favourite things to do with my VGC teams is to find a Pokemon I don't see used often, and trying to see what I can do with it.

As for Smogon's system, I don't really think it deserves the hate and ridicule it often gets. Every decision they make on bans and the like is voted on by the community, but not just any old scrub who hates Greninja can turn up. To vote you have to achieve a certain ranking on the ladder, or your opinion doesn't count. This way you get a metagame built by its most skilled players. Then again, I've barely been on Smogon since I started VGC, so what do I know?

I'm always open to a challenge, whether ingame or on Showdown. My 3DS info should be in my signature, so feel free to hit me up if you think you can beat me down!
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#2
(08-27-2015, 11:20 PM)Eonrider Wrote: As for Smogon's system, I don't really think it deserves the hate and ridicule it often gets. Every decision they make on bans and the like is voted on by the community, but not just any old scrub who hates Greninja can turn up. To vote you have to achieve a certain ranking on the ladder, or your opinion doesn't count. This way you get a metagame built by its most skilled players. Then again, I've barely been on Smogon since I started VGC, so what do I know?

Technically true, however, the system is rather inherently flawed. The bans are handed out based on a select few's opinions - rather than having a poll available to more people who are higher ranked, with options based on recent developments in the metagame (eg; when ORAS was released, have options to unban pokemon like Mawile). These options weren't considered to the select few - once they have an idea, they generally like to stick to it - and these ideas are VERY biased towards buffing the stall gameplay - very fun. Speaking of circlejerks, that's what the majority poll for the bans tends to be - once a highly-respected member gives an opinion, that's it - their word is law. Nothing anybody else says is considered as much.

Here's what should be done to fix their system:

- When selecting options for a ban, ensure that a number of players who play different playstyles are chosen to discuss.
- When selecting options for a ban, consider multiple options, not just one.
- When multiple options are chosen, allow a greater majority of players (only high-ranking players) to vote for the bans/unbans they would be okay suspect testing.
- When multiple options are chosen, allow people to vote for multiple different bans. This is because voting for one option in a multi-choice poll is, by far, one of the most questionable ideas people have had. Say you've got 5 people. 3 of them are vegetarians, 2 of them essentially survive off meat. They want to eat out - they can either go to a meat place, a pizza place, or a vegetarian place. If you can only vote for 1 option, the vegetarian place wins, leaving the meat people dead.
- When suspect testing, make members post anonymously about their opinions. Anybody who does not post anonymously (eg; talking about the ban outside of the thread) can be faced with harsh consequences.
- When suspect testing, don't just consider what the immediate effects of the ban are, consider every effect. When Mega Mawile was banned, sure, it helped stall live longer, good for them. However, Mega Mawile being banned also lead to less counters for Greninja. Greninja's popularity rose to the point where it also had to be banned - rather ironically, due to the lack of counters for it.
- When suspect testing, promote the usage of lesser-used pokemon. As it is, there is no staler metagame than VGC. The second most stale metagame is OU. Nobody tries to innovate in OU, they just use what they're told to.
- After a suspect test, LET THE METAGAME SETTLE. THIS ISN'T A BAN RACE.
- UNBAN BATON PASS CHAINS. This is, by far, the clearest example of stall-loving in Smogon. Stall is essentially the only playstyle which can't counter Baton Passes, and Baton Pass chains are only threatening to low-ranking players.
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#3
I absolutely love competitive battling. It's really the only kind of Pokemon I play anymore (besides the Turquoise RP occasionally), but I play it almost every day. I play Smogon style because I don't know anything about VGA other than having heard of it a couple times. I'm open to a different metagame but I also don't really have a problem with Smogon's rules and tiers. I generally find them reasonable and I don't know enough about the process to criticize it. Is VGA only played in game, or is there a Showdown style place for it online?

If anyone wants to challenge me, I'm always up for it if I'm available. I'll subscribe to this thread so I get notifications of any new posts instantly on my phone, and if I'm free I can respond within seconds. I used to have 50+ teams in nearly every imaginable tier, but I actually lost them all because I was stupid and didn't back them up. Right now I really only play LC, but if you want to challenge me in another tier I can make a team, although it will take awhile. My username in Showdown is the same as here.
कालो ऽस्मि लोकक्षयकृत् प्रवृद्धो लोकान्समाहर्तुमिह प्रवृत्त
“Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds.”
-Bhagavad Gita (XI, 32), as quoted by J. Robert Oppenheimer

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#4
(08-28-2015, 04:21 PM)BlackInfinityEE129 Wrote: I absolutely love competitive battling. It's really the only kind of Pokemon I play anymore (besides the Turquoise RP occasionally), but I play it almost every day. I play Smogon style because I don't know anything about VGA other than having heard of it a couple times. I'm open to a different metagame but I also don't really have a problem with Smogon's rules and tiers. I generally find them reasonable and I don't know enough about the process to criticize it. Is VGA only played in game, or is there a Showdown style place for it online?

If anyone wants to challenge me, I'm always up for it if I'm available. I'll subscribe to this thread so I get notifications of any new posts instantly on my phone, and if I'm free I can respond within seconds. I used to have 50+ teams in nearly every imaginable tier, but I actually lost them all because I was stupid and didn't back them up. Right now I really only play LC, but if you want to challenge me in another tier I can make a team, although it will take awhile. My username in Showdown is the same as here.

I'm assuming you mean VGC, as there's no such thing as VGA as far as I'm aware.

VGC is essentially the doubles mode in the Battle Maison, but as a metagame. If you're okay with really quick battles and... *ahem* the great "variety" (by variety, i mean "copy+paste genies - the metagame"), it's not too bad. Sure, it's a metagame where loads more pokemon are viable, unlike OU, but you're still going to get your ass handed to you by the copy+paste teams I just linked.
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#5
I've never been good at competitive battling, and I tend to get bored of it really quickly.

I guess it's too strategic for me? I dunno, but I guess I'm just terrible at making teams that work well in all (or even most) situations. Most of the time, I'm just using Pokemon that I like with very little attention given to their viability in every situation, and how well they work together. So yeah, every time I go onto showdown I get whooped.

Infinity keeps bugging me to get back into battling, and he's even helped me with a Little Cup team. I suppose I'll give it a shot, but I don't know how long I'll last. I'd love to get back into doubles, but I don't think I will anytime soon..
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